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Post by veronica on Oct 11, 2011 6:25:35 GMT -8
This is from a scientific study covered in the New York Times and definitely describes our challenge with boundaries. The book they're referring to isn't published yet and the article tries to cover a lot of territory. They describe indignation as physically addictive. If you've been abused, it's easy to see how the relief of being indignant (or right) can become an end in itself. An indirect way to deal with the feelings of being wrong and wronged. And make for some poor social interaction and self-care, becoming martyrs to a cause. www.nytimes.com/2011/10/04/science/04angier.html?_r=1&src=me&ref=scienceSome snips: “It epitomized the idea ‘I know how to do the right thing, and when I decide to do the right thing it can never be called pathological,’ ” "Selflessness gone awry may play a role in a broad variety of disorders, including anorexia and animal hoarding, women who put up with abusive partners and men who abide alcoholic ones. It fosters the exhilarating sensation of righteous indignation, the belief in the purity of your team and your cause and the perfidiousness of all competing teams and causes." “They are terribly sensitive to the needs of those around them,” she said in an interview. “They know who needs to be pushed in a wheelchair, who needs a word of encouragement, who needs to be fed.” Yet the spectral empaths will express no desires of their own. “They try to hide their needs or deny their needs or pretend their needs don’t exist,” Dr. Bachner-Melman went on. “They barely feel they have the right to exist themselves.” They apologize for themselves, for the hated, hollow self, by giving, ceaselessly giving." |
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Post by happyberry on Oct 11, 2011 6:30:13 GMT -8
thanks for sharing
isn't "Pathological Altruist" just another word for Codependent?
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Post by Loving My Life on Oct 11, 2011 6:58:27 GMT -8
it sounds like it could be, "altruistic" is helping others. I learned that in bills story in the AA big book.
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Post by veronica on Oct 11, 2011 19:32:22 GMT -8
HB, that made me laugh. Funny they didn't use the word right? It's something people would recognize. Maybe 'pathological altruist' just sounds more credible to write a book about from a scientific perspective. Although it seems 'the science of co-dependency' might sell a few more copies. I'm really curious what the book is going to provide as the science in all of this. I might actually read it, or hey! -- manipulate my medically knowledgable hubby to do it  |
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Post by Loving My Life on Oct 11, 2011 19:45:50 GMT -8
V, keep us posted...i got a laugh also. good-night.
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Post by LovelyJune on Oct 12, 2011 3:00:48 GMT -8
That sounds like D! He offered to take his sis to the airport at 4:30 in the morning once. At first I thought, "WOw! He's so altruistic!" But the more I thought I about it, it sounded nuts to me. Then again, you're talking to a girl that goes to bed at 8pm.  |
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Post by ontheroad on Dec 13, 2011 9:39:13 GMT -8
These behaviors are exactly what my girlfriend exhibits. I didn't understand it for a while, but now I definitely know why these things bother me. Because it is TOO much and actually hurts our relationship.
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Post by ontheroad on Dec 13, 2011 9:43:49 GMT -8
LovelyJune,
My girlfriend offered to take her best friend to school (her best friend doesnt have a car) four weeks in a row at 3AM, and sometimes 2 times a week. It really started bothering me. After that, she bought her a $300 b-day present, then got her family $300 worth of tickets for a holiday gift, and brought her entire sports team (of 40 people) cut of fruit 4 practices in a row. She has an addiction to it almost...
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Post by LovelyJune on Dec 13, 2011 11:57:00 GMT -8
ontheroad...WOW! That's what I call a displaced Mother Teresa syndrome. SHe could be putting all that selfless energy into helping people who really need it. Interesting. Thanks for sharing.
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Post by Healing Ku'uipo on Dec 13, 2011 12:30:22 GMT -8
For the pat few years Ive been extra self abosorbed. All kinds of drama.
My best friend and I would meet for breakfast 2 min from my house.
She was always complaining of being 'harried' and stressed.
Since being in therapy she has asked to meet closer to her, like half way.
And I realized I wasnt being fair by asking her to drive 20 min... ( I wasnt really aware of it)
We are more balanced and fair with each other now that both of us have been in recovery.
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Post by sober on Dec 14, 2011 0:35:36 GMT -8
LovelyJune, My girlfriend offered to take her best friend to school (her best friend doesnt have a car) four weeks in a row at 3AM, and sometimes 2 times a week. It really started bothering me. After that, she bought her a $300 b-day present, then got her family $300 worth of tickets for a holiday gift, and brought her entire sports team (of 40 people) cut of fruit 4 practices in a row. She has an addiction to it almost... Thanks for sharing this. I can relate to your GF. I don't mind spending even $ 3,000 or more for a best friend and if there's a need for me to stay up at 3am for a year I would gladly do it for her. I never calculated anything I did for her or others. For me it's true friendship and sincere giving. But I never "advertised" what I did for her. I kept things in a low profile. I wonder why it seems to bother you? Does it make you jealous? Don't you think it's none of your business how she deals w/ her best friend? I hate being "scrutinized" when it comes to friendship and giving. Believe it or not there are people gifted w/ generosity and not bec they are addicted or something. |
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Post by LovelyJune on Dec 14, 2011 4:08:14 GMT -8
I agree Sober. And Mother Theresa is a perfect example. All her giving was well-directed. But when your giving and doing for others doesn't match the needs or wants of where it is being directed, there's a bit of a problem. Getting up at 4am to help a friend out who is in need is being a good friend. Getting up at 4am to help a friend out when they could be doing it themselves is codependency. When your value and worth is wrapped up in what you do for others or what you "buy" or "lavish" on them, can oftentimes (not always) be unhealthy.
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Post by ontheroad on Dec 19, 2011 10:46:25 GMT -8
Hi Sober. No, I am not jealous. And my girlfriend never advertised it either. Like LovelyJune said, it seemed to be codependent behavior, and she is "taking care of her" in order to gain her approval. Her best friend is more than capable of getting her transportation and life together without my gf doing it for her. Her teammates are also more than capable of bringing their own snack to practice. My gf and I discussed this, and she came to the conclusion that it would be healthy to put some boundaries and limits on what she does for her best friend/family/others. She agreed that it is not reciprocated by anyone, and that she shouldn't be paying money or spending energy to get others to like and accept her. She is actually working on having a conversation with her to tell her that when we go out, she needs to pay for her own stuff from now on. Previously, she didn't pay for anything, didn't tell us she couldn't afford to go out until we picked her up, and didn't even get my gf a birthday present. So, it is nice to be generous towards people once in a while, when you have the means to do so. But there is a point where boundaries are broken, which is what Pathological Altruism seems to be about.
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