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Post by luvmyself2 on Feb 6, 2012 18:13:13 GMT -8
I have that same thing, LB, and it's been that way since I was a kid having crushes on boys. The more I liked them, the more of an idiot I felt around them not able to be myself, making me basically unable to talk to them or express my interest. Which is why I lived with year-long fantasy crushes on boys I never got to date. And it caused me to be a major late bloomer, making all my mistakes much later on in life than most people!
Also, this: "I swear to god, I would push an old lady down the stairs if it meant being with my POA." This is a great way to describe what I just went through about 3 weeks ago that started my downward spiral -- I met some new friends in person after being friends with them both online for nearly a year. Because the woman annoyed me, and I felt a strong romantic connection with the guy (they were best friends but not together), I ended up manipulating the situation toward the end of my stay so I could spend more time with him and not her -- and I didn't tell her this. It was manipulative and wrong of me, and after I got back from the trip I found that they were both severely angry at me, and I apologized but it was not enough to keep their friendship. Looking back there are some good reasons why I shouldn't be friends with them -- but it just goes to show you how severe my love addiction got without me realizing it. I was willing to manipulate people to get closer to a guy. They were not having it. This also happened the same week I found out that my ex had a girlfriend and was engaged ...
Anyway, glad to be "in recovery" now.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 8, 2012 3:16:53 GMT -8
“If we believe that tomorrow will be better, we can bear a hardship today.”
— Thich Nhat Hanh
This is what I'm banking on today.
Seems reputation is everything....I'm going to build on my own rep...and what I think of myself. This triangle stuff is not what I want for myself. Nothing good comes forward because of it. Nothing. Except here, which may have made it worth it?
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 8, 2012 8:43:56 GMT -8
Awful. Today is really awful. And I am to blame on this one. I indulged myself with him and it was horrible beyond words. I don't need to do this.
It's 11:30 in the morning and I have read some posts here as smelling salts, and I will go back at it. I also asked him, ONLY FOR SHOW, if he was ok with me pulling back completely and that it wouldn't bother him. I only asked this as a version of 'you-can't-say-I-didn't-warn-you.
I have made a complete fool out of myself and he did see 'crazy.' LOL maybe he'll happily stay away from me too.
Mostly I hate that he has 'seen' this craziness in me. I'm not sure how I will get over it. I hate to think he will or would feel superior. He also said that "no I can't let you have sex with me because you'll like me too much." This is ground zero for me. It's one thing to know how bad I am in addiction, but it's another when someone else can see it.
I think he really brings out my sickness. And I allow it.
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Post by luvmyself2 on Feb 8, 2012 9:12:23 GMT -8
Hi LB, I'm sorry you're having a rough day. What you just described is how I imagine things will go if I contact my ex to indulge my insecurities in needing confirmation from him that he still cares about me. I have to constantly dispute the thoughts in my head of the concerns I have that I want to address with him still. By the time we talk it will sound naive and crazy to bring these issues up again with him, since we already talked at length about these issues. Ugh. I feel your pain. And I hate that feeling too that they can see our craziness and how it makes them look/feel superior to us. Just hate it.
We have to hang in there and just keep working our program with the willingness to recover.
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foolmetwice
Full Member
"A star danced, and under that was I born." Shakespeare
Posts: 196
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Post by foolmetwice on Feb 8, 2012 14:23:47 GMT -8
You need to stop thinking of yourself as sick. Even though this is an addiction, it took a lifetime to get to where you are now. You're still "dancing" with him and then beating yourself up. You MUST DECIDE to be all BUSINESS when at work. Stop trying to console each other re. asking if he's okay with what you need and him telling you what you need. It's just none of his business anymore. Also, be more patient with yourself. I like the word gentle, as if taking care of a delicate being, which you are, by the way. Your inner child is waiting for you to look inward instead of outward. There's a few off the top of my head for you for now. Enjoy your evening, I'll be back later.
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Post by luvmyself2 on Feb 8, 2012 14:28:16 GMT -8
Hi lead, thanks for that, no, I shouldn't go backward. I'm here, also not doing very well today ... hardly got any work done because my "work" now is my recovery. Totally isolated in my place, and having conversations with myself in my head about why I don't want or need to contact my ex. Realizing that abstinence is simply forcing me to face some truths I didn't want to face, like how much I want to be a victim and how little I want to take responsibility for my own life. This is hard, and this sucks. Recovery is very difficult, but an absolute necessity.
I'm sorry you're feeling panicked. I get that. Let me share something with you though: remember that recovery is not optional unless you want to live in this disease. Case in point: I've got HLN on right now, with this sad case of a college kid who was an alcoholic who murdered his ex-gf, because she slept with another man. I also heard someone in my meeting mention how someone he knew in recovery backslid and was found dead -- don't know if it was murder or suicide yet.
Bottom line: This disease of addiction is serious business. It DOES lead to death (well sometimes in extreme cases) and other bad things. If we remember that, maybe it will help us to be proud of ourselves for choosing recovery. I hope that helps in some way.
I agree that we need to be patient with ourselves, easy does it, one day at a time. It doesn't happen overnight, and it probably would help for us to take some breaks from all this and try to find some things to enjoy in life because we are more than just our addiction.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 8, 2012 16:36:18 GMT -8
thank you foolmetwice and Luv....thankyouthankyouthankyou BUT
I went right down the klinker. Because he said NO to me and I went apesh*t. He actually didn't even want to continue - over and over again he said that but caved because I wanted him so badly. JUST.BECAUSE.I.COULDN'T.HAVE.HIM. and I told him when he was trying to tell me he wanted out....that he wasn't coming from a place of strength and being noble, it was because he was seeing 'crazy' in me and didn't want any trouble.
After our physical contact I felt really really calm and relieved - like any addict....and will now have to do alot of work to help myself before the next time. I have accepted that there will be a next time, but the time frames will get longer and longer - and my plan is to get stronger and stronger. I am very powerless over this - very badly and there is no point at this point jacking myself up to believe that I can say NO and mean it when I know I can't. For now.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 9, 2012 9:52:02 GMT -8
Feeling much clearer today, and I'm going to say something hard: my POA was decent to me last night in light of how upset I was. I respect him for this. He has no idea that this is a relationship that doesn't exist! only in my mind. And I need him to stop paying for whatever didn't workout in my life previous to him. Although he is very selfserving and a whole other host of things I don't really admire in another he still does not deserve my wrath.
I am able to totally and completely initiate NC today in my way and hope that my repetitive thinking slows down and then completely stop around him. He is not what I think or thought he was. But that's not his fault....sort of like getting married without the groom :-)
While I am recovery and finding my way UP again - I need to strike a PLAN on what I want to achieve in terms of health....even my own opinion of myself is that of a "lunatic" because I am able to see my horrid behavior. I already know that my opinion of a relationship is one of doom and heartache and failure - and guess what? that's exactly what I get.
I'm sorry to display such a struggle....but as the Chinese say: "Much chaos before brilliance."
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Post by luvmyself2 on Feb 9, 2012 9:57:59 GMT -8
I feel the same way LB, I don't think my ex deserves my wrath either -- he made it clear from the start that we weren't ever going to get back together and what he wanted was a friendship. I do think my ex in his own way does care, even though he is twisted and lacks boundaries. I feel better taking responsibility for my part and just trying to do NC the best I can. I don't feel good getting angry at him, although at times it does feel warranted, but I don't like to stay in it.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 9, 2012 11:42:10 GMT -8
I am in every way - leaving a relationship that never was!
My POA is not love or loving material - but he did not bring this on....I did. I created something in my own mind and he had no idea. I have, in effect let myself off the hook by blaming him. I ruined things and I need to take full responsibility for this because it will happen again as I look for excuses as how SOMEBODY ELSE done me wrong. I have hurt myself and him, very much and need to stop my fantasies - they are no more real than him being in love with me and living happily ever after.
I do believe I have found my stark start.
My father was not nice to me - hit me and called me names - overall made me feel bad about myself always. I can never make my past right and so I give it up and over. It is too big for me - and trying to find someone to make it and me alright will never happen. It's never too late but I still hope the best and my best is yet to come. I have been living in shadows my whole life - but ones I created.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 9, 2012 17:09:52 GMT -8
did my version of NC with my POA - it was hard - but I did it respectfully - and snapped down the urges to go,be,desire,crave,ache,arch....these emotionals are not real. Will try again tomorrow.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 11, 2012 16:11:26 GMT -8
Did not do NC at all yesterday. But I guess because I got a 'hit' I feel calm and am able to take in more information/education here and other site about healing.
I have so many things to get over and past....and I need to get my food - binge and purge under strict control. I am going to do a 30 day run at it so will be posting that here as it's in direct relation to my love addiction. I also do not feel the same compulsion to go into my POA's office every minute....so my lack of urge there will help next week. I have also acknowledged that he has been exceptionally kindhearted towards me and yes it does affect me and my limercing, but I also am acutely aware of the depth of sh*t I'm in.
I'm also watching a show called "Taboo" where they are profiling a man who is in love with his car and show him kissing and licking his car and reading poetry to it = they are called Object Sexuals....*sigh* I am grateful I am bad, but not this bad.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 12, 2012 12:59:54 GMT -8
Day #3 - No bingeing, purging and NC - it's easy for the NC because it's the weekend. I have caught myself 8,000 times thinking about him, but was able to interrupt it. I want my brain back.
Today it's important that I begin to ALLOW, and I do really mean ALLOW good things to come into me. It will change my chemistry. I'm hoping as I change my selfcare I will get stronger and stronger and want to help myself more and more. I really need to say that I have an extremely low opinion of myself.
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Post by ramaplame on Feb 12, 2012 16:24:27 GMT -8
leadbelly I am so so sorry you are going through this.
I want to tell you that I'm really happy that you want to change -- I can tell that you want to do that and free yourself, and that makes me very happy -- but I am concerned for you.
If it were me I know I would not be able to go back to work at the same job. For me it would be like trying to get sober while going to a crack house 5 days a week. If it's absolutely impossible for you to leave... I don't know the solution. Maybe some old timers can give you advice because I know you really want to start your recovery and I know you're trying so hard! I don't want you to have to suffer anymore.
What really concerned me was this passage about your sexual encounter with him:
"Because he said NO to me and I went apesh*t. He actually didn't even want to continue - over and over again he said that but caved because I wanted him so badly. JUST.BECAUSE.I.COULDN'T.HAVE.HIM. and I told him when he was trying to tell me he wanted out....that he wasn't coming from a place of strength and being noble, it was because he was seeing 'crazy' in me and didn't want any trouble."
I'm not sure why that passage troubled me the way it did. I guess it worries me that you heard "no" and kept pressuring him to get your hit.
I really hope an old timer can help you out because I totally don't have the answers to this, girl. But I'm rooting for you for sure.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 13, 2012 8:48:17 GMT -8
Was almost going to quit here due to lack of support, but will continue on just seeing how things go and because I received a very encouraging email from baggagereclaim on how to get over POA's that you work with, and undeniably Natalie said that she was living proof that it can be done.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 13, 2012 13:40:04 GMT -8
Day #4 - no binge/purge and NC (but a work version)
Was able to be my own observer. And watched as I felt jealousy - ack!!!!! as he spoke to others in his great way.
I just get so sad because of the depth and strength of my feelings and never being able to do anything about it....because it is barren for me in return. It is hard to turn away, and I can see how great he is (and not so great as well)....I see both sides and mostly I can see how I have been interacting with him, and now because of it, my whole history with men. No wonder I could never make a go of it. It is me thinking the thoughts and assuming if I am thinking this way, then so are YOU!!!! Not even close. A big huge awakening for me.
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Post by luvmyself2 on Feb 14, 2012 6:35:43 GMT -8
Hi leadbelly. "It is me thinking the thoughts and assuming if I am thinking this way, then so are YOU!!!! Not even close. A big huge awakening for me."
Wow, I do the same thing, in fact, I am a Master at it! Assuming a person is thinking of me the same way I think of him. I'll have a whole set of "signs" that I can easily paint a big wonderful picture out of to make it appear that a situation with someone is in my favor -- I can create a whole fantasy out of it (boy am I creative). Like with my ex, I wrote down months ago a whole list of strange signals he was giving me with things he said/did, and was nearly interpreting it as him possibly surprising me with a proposal! (even though we were broken up and he had moved away) ... I was shattered when I learned that indeed he was proposing, but not to me!
I did things like this to with my mega-PoA, the one I was obsessed with for many, many years. Interpreted the signs of whatever he did or didn't do as if it meant he really was in love with me. It's frightening, isn't it, to realize that what we create in our heads is often just a fantasy? How did that happen?
I almost quit here too by the way, in fact I did for a day, because I didn't feel support either. I wrote a suicidal rant that no one responded to, and felt sorry for myself. Not many people post here. I looked up SLAA again and will probably attend the phone meetings just so I don't feel alone. I don't know if LAA has regular meetings like that but it might be better than just this forum.
I think everyone writing their own journals actually has turned out badly, because now no one is seeing every comment that's posted to people's personal journals because they don't know the topics. Someone suggested we do a "Group Conscience" ... I liked the forum before we did our journals. I needed to see those relevant topics pop up.
I wrote in my journal thread nonetheless today, mostly about what I'm doing to choose recovery and self-care today. I'm with you LB.
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Post by ramaplame on Feb 14, 2012 16:58:03 GMT -8
Hello! Yes, I do the same thing. Now what I do is when I think of someone I immediately remind myself. I'll think "I miss him -- he must be missing me -- No. He's not thinking of me. He's doing something else. He cares about other people and he's spending time with them."
It is a lonely realization -- but it helps to remind myself immediately so I don't fantasize.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 14, 2012 17:11:04 GMT -8
Whump there it is!!! I love that Rama -that's a really really good line to feed my addictive inner dialogue - when it JUST starts to begin. Because you know what - it's totally 100% true...they are just doing something else and not sloshing around thoughts of me!
What freedom.
*sigh*
I didn't do anything right today. I can hardly wait until tomorrow comes.
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Post by luvmyself2 on Feb 14, 2012 17:57:06 GMT -8
Hi lead, thanks for posting in my other thread. I also can't wait till tomorrow comes. Only 3 more hours, lol.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 15, 2012 15:06:41 GMT -8
More shock today. I see how my nonlove for myself shows up in absolutely everything....even housework.
I am going to have to begin that journey right NOW in respecting myself, telling myself the truth, being kind and patient and forgiving to myself, holding and keeping boundaries that keep me safe physically and emotionally....I may be 55 years old, but it's not too late.
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Post by ramaplame on Feb 16, 2012 16:30:07 GMT -8
It's never too late.
Are you keeping a journal? That helps me a lot.
What do you mean about nonlove in housework? I've been cleaning today and omg it is crazy how I always get myself into these messes -- material and relationship wise. *sigh* But I am going to work through it.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 16, 2012 18:05:48 GMT -8
Hey Rama, I think maybe housework should be called housecare....it's just a reflection of caring about how I live, where I live....LOL Rama - just throw out everything....I wish I could just hose down my apartment.
POA couldn't be bothered with me today. So I just disappeared at 5:00 to avoid feeling like stuff any longer. I tried connecting with him today, but during those times I just go unconscious....just not a good thing.
On Tuesday, as he told me, he was really mean to his wife, screaming at her, making her cry and kicking her out of the bedroom and was screaming at his kids to be quiet late at night....he told me this because he felt so bad....I soothed him, but at the same time could not help myself in thinking what vicious little nothing he was.
I know in the past when my circular obsessive thinking suddenly stopped, the guy I was doing it to turned into dust and I never looked back - only to cringe. I am hoping this is done TONIGHT by some miracle in my mind.
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Post by luvmyself2 on Feb 16, 2012 19:04:02 GMT -8
"shows up in absolutely everything....even housework."
Yup, this is exactly what has made me realize that this is a disease. This isn't just some "problem" or "issue" but an insidious disease that left unchecked finds its way into every single area of my life. My health, my love life, my money, my jobs, my friends, my family, my home -- frickin' everything. The codependency, the love addiction, just filters into all of it. That's how I know I need recovery.
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Post by Herenow on Feb 18, 2012 15:54:17 GMT -8
You would have a completely different life if you changed the dialog, it is that straight forward, but like you say, not easy to do. What a great post, so full of self and self responsibility. I think for me when I started really getting it was up to me to do the work my life started changing for the better. Lots of work but it ain't all bad or hard a lot of it is fun and playful and unbelievably fulfilling! Wow makes me smile. Thanks!
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 18, 2012 16:11:00 GMT -8
thank you diane...I appreciate your faith in me and kind words....it helps that's for sure.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 26, 2012 12:25:37 GMT -8
I am slowly and imperfectly removing myself from my part of the mess. I was thinking that when you're with someone who is so wrong in every way for you, it brings out the very worst. And I have glaringly seen how ugly inside I am, or at least acting out that way. Quick temper, poor judgement, sad as heII, depressed, jealousy, I could go on....and I'm only giving off headlines.....I just really feel like my 'goodness' has been shattered....and it ALL comes from not respecting or liking myself. If I had only known that I was good enough and ok all along....that I would have had to never of worried about being loved so as not to make me so desperate. And if I had only known - and it's never too late - that if I had of found a passion, a hobby or fascination with 'something' it would not have made finding a dysfunctional man a vocation, and made or turned them into everything.
The need for them to make me real is over. I can honestly say that I will never 'love' the way I've 'loved' ever again, because it's not love at all. I know this now. The 'way' I have been has taken away the best part of living - and although I say it blindly, because I don't know what awaits me - I do have faith that it must be so much better that how I've been living and certainly the way I was in the past.
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Post by leadbelly on Feb 27, 2012 14:18:38 GMT -8
Not at work today - so having a good one. What occupied my thoughts today was wondering what's next for me. What do I even like?? Don't even want to start up the ratwheel of thinking about a possible partner. It's possible that I may be alone for the rest of my days and I am working on accepting that. Life is big. I don't want to close down now. I've been going "this" way for a long, long time and now it's time to go "that" way.
My plan: stick with my personal goals, be pleasant and cordial at work - that's all that is required of me....and I can create the space. I know how much it will hurt this POA that we're not going to be friends because I don't want him as my friend. I ask myself why would I want someone who doesn't really care about me at the end of the day.
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