The permanent shame | A Brighter Tomorrow

iamastar
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The permanent shame Oct 29, 2013 10:16:51 GMT -8

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Post by iamastar on Oct 29, 2013 10:16:51 GMT -8

At this point, I still feel shame about the way I behaved when far into my LA. I lied, I cheated, I made promises I didn't have the ability or the intention of keeping. Sometimes particular memories of things I've said back then comes to mind, and I cringe at my own words.

A while ago I saw my POA's new girlfriend at an event, and I can't even bring myself to look at her. There has been a lot of jealousy going on from my part, which has partly faded now, but the main reason I can't face her is because of what I did to her. A part of me wants to tell her that I am sorry that I had an affair with her boyfriend, that I never meant to be that kind of person. But what is it to her? Also, I think it would only amplify my own pain and self-pity. And I'm not even sure that she knows what really happened back then, so I could be messing things up at a whole new level if I ever talk to her. It's just, whenever I see her I get this heavy, dark feeling in my gut, and I do believe that it is shame.

Going through seeing them again has definitely taken it's toll on me.

I don't want to go into the POA stuff right now, but I believe that an important step to moving on completely (which I clearly haven't) is forgiving myself for these past actions that I regret so deeply. I keep thinking "You're a horrible person, and you deserved what you got", but I do believe that assumption is a fallacy, because there's too many unknown factors involved. Maybe I really am better off without this person in my life, and what happens in life doesn't just come down to my actions. I'm trying to find the balance-point between owning my actions and taking responsibility for them, but without blaming myself to a point where it's destructive for my sense of self-worth... I hope this makes sense.

I keep thinking about my mother who never took responsibility for anything in her life, and keeps telling this tale with herself as a blameless victim (which she was, her entire childhood). She is a full-blown love-addict, and will be so until the day she dies. The worst part is, I do believe that she herself believes in her own stories when she says that there was nothing she could do to prevent her 5 children from years of neglect, abuse and molestation. If I want to know what my life will look like if I don't break the cycle, all I have to do is look at her. I kills me.

So I know where assuming no responsibility will take me. But the other extreme is the one where I keep hitting myself in the head with every single action that I make or don't make, and are so obsessed with always doing the right thing that failing to live up to my very best is devastating and exhausting. And at the same time my inner LA goes "cut yoursef a little slaaaaack... You can have fun..." while she goes on to manipulate everyone around her, and then I'm back to square one.

That's it for now. Felt good to address that part of me, it's been on my mind for a long time.

Lots of light.

Loving My Life
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The permanent shame Oct 29, 2013 10:30:16 GMT -8

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Post by Loving My Life on Oct 29, 2013 10:30:16 GMT -8

iamastar, You are probably right not to say anything, if you are just willing in your heart to ask for forgiveness, and you are truly sorry, this is enough. But in the process of forgiving her, forgive yourself as well. We are our own worst enemy. If we were healthy ourselves at that time, we would have made better decisions. We have to know better in order to do better.

And it is hard, but we are not perfect human beings, and we do make mistakes.

Thank you for sharing this with us, it does feel better when we do share.

Hang in there, and stop taking thing so seriously, learn to laugh again.

PS: Glad your back on the forum.

One day at a time :-) :-). . .We can do together, what we could never do alone. :-) And a problem shared, is a problem cut in half. :-) :-)

LovelyJune
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The permanent shame Oct 29, 2013 13:32:01 GMT -8

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Post by LovelyJune on Oct 29, 2013 13:32:01 GMT -8

Yes. You do need to forgive yourself. Especially if you have stopped the behavior and have not continued in any way to hurt yourself or others.

What caught my attention though, more so than not knowing whether to confront this person or not, is your level of self-hate. Or maybe I should say, self-dislike! And the trouble you have dealing with guilt and needing to lightening up etc. What I think might help you enormously, if you haven't already done so, is to write out a list of your VALUES. When we know what is most important to us and meaningful to us, and we right it down and KNOW IT, it becomes a map or a guide for our behavior. For example, if one of your values is "I will never cheat, and I will never stay with someone who cheats" you know to stay away from anyone who is in a relationship. And whether you have "feelings" for this person or not doesn't matter. Having a relationship with someone who is already in a relationship is your OWN deal breaker. This takes all the guessing out of what you can and cannot do.

On my values list, if you don't already know, it says, "I will not be in a romantic relationship with anyone who does drugs or is an alcoholic. Period. So, in my early dating days, I knew to steer clear of anyone who partook. Sometimes I found out right away, and sometimes I found out later, a few months into the relationship, which made a break up harder, but inevitable. But I had learned by then, that a healthy person always chooses her values over a relationship.

Being so sure of yourself and having a list of values that you stick to will also help to reduce the feelings of shame (because you are on a clearer path) and will help you forgive yourself (because you are participating in right action).

Last Edit: Oct 29, 2013 13:33:26 GMT -8 by LovelyJune

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iamastar
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The permanent shame Oct 30, 2013 6:52:48 GMT -8

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Post by iamastar on Oct 30, 2013 6:52:48 GMT -8

Thank you all for your kind and insightful responses. It confirmed a lot of the things I already sensed where true.

With regards to my POA's new girlfriend, I have no intention of confronting her about my shame. As I've said, I'm not even sure she knows what he did to her, so I don't know if she knows that she is with a liar and a cheater (which makes me glad I'm not her, no matter what the truth is). But to me it doesn't really matter if she decided to stay with him despite his cheating, it doesn't change what I did. Although I have some distance from it now, and I see that it isn't all my fault, I know the issue will come up again when I'll eventually see them both again. Hopefully, I will be in an even better place by then.

On Values: I did write down a list of my values at some point in my recovery, and I still think about the subject very often. I cut contact to both of my parents because their behavior crossed some of my most important values (I will not allow people to abuse me verbally). But maybe it's time to go over my values again. Cheating is definitely a deal-breaker for me. I am unsure about whether I could forgive someone for cheating, but personally I will never cheat on any partner again.

As for keeping my own values I have succeeded on the most part, but I do realize now that there are times when I've strayed. This is mostly in the little things, but maybe it doesn't really matter when it comes down to my sense of self-worth. For instance, I feel that I have in some cases been manipulative towards men (behavior I've been trying to get rid of). I also said some things to my POA at this event that crossed the line of verbal abuse. He kept touching me, and I told him several times not to but he didn't listen. We where both drunk, and at the end I said something along the lines of "If you ever touch me again I will kick your *beeep*". I know it's seemingly nothing major - after all I didn't overstep his boundaries, but somehow it made me feel exposed. Had I been sober and in my right mind, I would simply remove myself from the situation, or said that his behavior made me feel uncomfortable.
(I feel that I should also note that he wasn't touching me in a sexual way - he just kept touching a tattoo I have on my arm).

So... That was a little soul-searching. I will write more extensively on this later. For now, I am trying to keep self-hatred and obsession at bay.

Lots of light.

honey
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The permanent shame May 29, 2015 10:40:51 GMT -8

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Post by honey on May 29, 2015 10:40:51 GMT -8

I can absolutely relate to self-hatred and self-guilt. I do not know how someone can hate herself the way sometimes I do. I am in my addiction recovery now, and I have got a nice boy friend for 5 month now, but at times absolutely feel the urge for break up and chasing another unavailable partner. and it does not have any thing to do with what is happening between us. Some times I just feel I cant tolarate this huge amount of intimacy, anymore. It is so hard at times, and the problem is I could not find a support group of women where I am. and it makes the recovery journey so hard. I think I have passed the physical symptoms of my recovery but I am in post-acuate symptoms and I do feel mood swings and angriness, emotional numbness, ... Is there anyone who is in the same path as me?

LovelyJune
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The permanent shame May 30, 2015 3:12:10 GMT -8 RoseNadler likes this

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Post by LovelyJune on May 30, 2015 3:12:10 GMT -8

May 29, 2015 10:40:51 GMT -8 honey said:

Some times I just feel I cant tolarate this huge amount of intimacy, anymore.

Careful. Sometimes we can go from one extreme to another. Neither being healthy. I used to "swing" from relationships with avoidant men (where I could BREATHE) to men who wanted too much intimacy (where I felt SUFFOCATED). Sometimes we think if we are in a relationship with someone who pays us lots of attention and wants huge amounts of intimacy this is "healthy." But not necessarily. Like I said, it could be too much intimacy for you. You are supposed to feel comfortable in your relationship, as if you are with an old friend. You should feel like you have your breathing space, like you're getting enough attention but not too much, and that you can be yourself. If this is not happening, the pendulum may have swung in the opposite direction.

There's a great book out called The Dance of Intimacy. In it, it talks about each person's personal space and level of intimacy they feel comfortable with. We are ALL different. You may not be able to handle too much intimacy (I know I can't!). And so, that means finding a partner who respects your level of intimacy and can match it. My husband gives me a lot of space to breathe. At first he kinda smothered me, wanting to spend gobs of time with me. I told him "This relationship will not work if I feel smothered. I can't see you every day. I need more space." He not only respected my wishes, he matched them. And we are now able to have a very happy, free-flowing relationship.

Know what amount of intimacy you can handle and what you can't. And talk to your partner about it.

Last Edit: May 30, 2015 3:14:03 GMT -8 by LovelyJune

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CodepNomore
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The permanent shame May 30, 2015 5:18:00 GMT -8 RoseNadler likes this

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Post by CodepNomore on May 30, 2015 5:18:00 GMT -8

Yes honey, I have felt that way too. I sometimes wanted to run away from intimacy and find a "safety net" with a more familiar, unavailable partner. But to overcome this tendency I focused on my goal to go for a healthy, mutual relationship only. Part of a healthy relationship is finding balance and it has a give and take nature. I also sit with my feelings and learn to handle intimacy squarely. Now, I am enjoying it. It only feels awkward in the beginning.

Last Edit: May 30, 2015 5:18:58 GMT -8 by CodepNomore