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Post by BunnyEars on Nov 26, 2013 5:42:13 GMT -8
My current/main POA was a woman with whom I had a 5 month affair last year. She was a narcissist, she was emotionally abusive, I realized it and got out 8 months ago, went NC, unfriended her and any mutual friends likely to post about her on FB, ditched the pub trivia team we were both on, and I avoid her like the plague. We had a tense scene one night in late June outside a bar which she fled in tears, but I did not contact her after which I'm sure is what she was expecting.
Still, 8 months after the breakup, I spotted her driving by in her car last week, I was ok for a few days, then had a little cry. Though I'm feeling much better than I did even 3 months ago, I am so ready for indifference, and I just can't seem to get there. She is not the first woman I've lost my mind over, but the last one was nearly 20 years ago.
I'm a married woman (My husband allows me to date outside the marriage, though frankly, he'd rather I didn't) and I love my husband, but he doesn't give me the high she gave me. How can he after 16 years together of domestic life? I am terrified that at 41 years old, I will never again feel so much passion, but I also know that passion was manufactured by the fact that she never let me feel on solid footing. I'm worried that the only way to forget her is to obsess over someone else.
There are so many things I love about my life, but I ache for this THING I can't seem to hold onto. I've never had a woman love me the way I've wanted to be loved. I know bisexual relationships are inherently fraught with peril, so much potential for misaligned expectations, and I almost never behave this way with men--if anything, I play the love avoidant with men (I've done pretty well with making my husband feel loved enough to stay, but he's an exception) while with women I'm the love addict.
I distract myself with friends, books, writing, kayaking, biking, and even found a gorgeous, successful emotionally unavailable man to sleep with, but I don't obsess over him. I don't feel much of anything for him beyond physical attraction. Honestly, anytime I let down my guard for two seconds, thoughts of her rush in, and I'm so frustrated. Visualization, thought-stopping, distraction---nothing seems to work. I'm tired of being terrified to run into her. It's affecting my social life and my sense of well-being within the community. A lot of it has to do with how ashamed I fell for having fallen for her BS and made myself so lovesick over her.
I guess I'm looking for some deep healing/releasing techniques or some advice on how to really break an obsession which has lasted long after withdrawl and NC. How do I get over my shame and stand tall enough to face her when I run into her on our small island?
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Post by LovelyJune on Nov 26, 2013 8:22:31 GMT -8
Hi BunnyEars.
I'm not sure I have the best advice for you regarding your obsession over this woman. From all the reading I've ever done, obsession is a red flag. It is an indicator that there exists a person, place or thing we cannot possess (or in your case, have a relationship with) and we know we cannot have it, but are not willing to accept it. Beating obsessive thinking, means making peace with the fact that you cannot have the object of your desire.
But more troubling and possibly what is causing you more pain seems to be your lifestyle. I am the first to say that I don't believe marriage has to be just one way. Open marriages, gay marriages, even poligamy can work in some instances, if it's part of an acceptable culture. But what disturbs me is two things: the fact that you are hurting your husband by living this way, and two, that you are driven to seek "passion" through a very shallow means--through physical and emotional relationships that you cannot wholeheartedly commit to because you're married and already comitted to someone else. No wonder you are in a lot of pain. These are very unfulfilling ways to achieve happiness, peace and love.
That being said, you should understand how obsession and addiction do not signify your love of your PoA, but rather they signify avoidance of yourself and your problems. Deep healing begins when you face yourself and your problems. RIght now, you're running away, despite the fact that you're no longer with this other woman.
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Post by Loveanimals on Nov 26, 2013 8:33:51 GMT -8
Hi BunnyEars,
I can certainly relate. I am also in a celibate marriage, open marriage etc. and I can relate to the thing that a marriage with someone you've been with for many, many years doesn't have the same feeling as someone "new".
From these boards it's more of looking for that feeling we had as adolescents I take it. I still have a hard time with it. When I went through No Contact I tried to get that texting "high" from husband and got zero response.
Like LovelyJune said, it is avoidance of problems. We don't want to face an unhappy marriage and deal with the possibility of divorce, the words of society that we "can't find better" and that we're stuck due to age. To sit down, deal with selling a house, shuffling kids back and forth, dividing assets is horrifying. Chasing a new relationship is much, much more exciting, yet as my therapist says, the problem is still there, it's just being avoided.
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Post by BunnyEars on Nov 26, 2013 14:24:11 GMT -8
Hi BunnyEars. That being said, you should understand how obsession and addiction do not signify your love of your PoA, But what disturbs me is two things: the fact that you are hurting your husband by living this way, and two, that you are driven to seek "passion" through a very shallow means--through physical and emotional relationships that you cannot wholeheartedly commit to because you're married and already comitted to someone else. Roger that, LJ. Sadly, 5 months with a very charming narcissist left my brain and heart utterly scrambled. But I know not to act on my feelings. No Contact. I don't even talk about her to anyone I know IRL. My husband and I are working on a way that we can both be comfortable in the marriage. He knows I don't want to hurt him, but I am no longer at at this point willing to sacrifice certain parts of my sexuality to conform to a traditional marriage. My husband feels content with what he gets from me emotionally and sexually, and he doesn't desire more intimacy, more passion, more novelty. I, on the other hand, want all that. Do I have to trade in all the things I love about my husband and everything that works in the marriage to try to find that? Or am I just supposed to live without it? I've got to accept his limitations, after all. @loveanimals: Thanks for the reply! My marriage isn't celibate. We are intimate and the sex is okay, but my husband's libido is about one-third of mine, and he isn't very adventurous. I really think open marriages can work and be fulfilling, but my husband isn't so certain. We don't have kids or assets. So we stay together because so far, we choose to. But the way I obsess over emotionally unattainable women has got to go, and I've spent too many months with this particular POA in my psyche. It is no longer horrible or unbearable as it was at first, but it isn't comfortable. |
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Post by LovelyJune on Nov 29, 2013 4:53:17 GMT -8
There exists a logical, unemotional formula to help you decide whether to stay married or to leave. A decision that should never be taken lightly. Many of us don't have such a cut and dry decision to make--our spouses are not all bad or 100% inappropriate for us. They have many qualities we were initially drawn to and even love. And that causes us to make list of their postive and negative qualities, oftentimes seeing that there are more positives on the list than negatives. And this can be tricky, because then we say to ourselves, well, according to this list, why am I complaining??? I've got it pretty good. But we cannot make decisions about whether to stay with someone or leave based on a list of positives and negatives because all those items hold WEIGHT. That your husband has a great head of hair might hold some weight, but does it hold enough to counter something like, "he never kisses me anymore." So how do we figure out how much things "weight? The trick comes when you write out and know your own personal VALUES: those things that are ESSENTIAL to who you are and to the core of your being, that are different for all of us. You might have on your list: I must be with someone who enjoys sex, or I need someone who doesn't avoid me or neglect me… These "values" are the absolute most important requirements that make you happy and healthy and fulfilled, and they are not to be confused with "wants" or "wishes." A wish is something you would like to have in your life, but if you don't get it, you can still be happy and thrive. I may want a Porche, but I can still be happy and thrive with a Honda. I may want a guy with jet black curly hair, but if a blond haired guy was meeting all my other needs, I'll take him!
The tricky part comes in two places: are we able to decipher between a value and a wish, and are we able to see if our values are currently being met in our current relationship. Love addiction and obsessive thinking automatically cloud our ability to think clearly about our values. We tend to fall madly in love with a PoA and said I NEED THAT, that's got to be a value!!!! Or, we hold on to a less than perfect marriage (not saying that yours might be) out of fear of losing our grounding and stability, or fear of being alone, or fear of having to provide for ourselves.
Anyway, these are all things to ask yourself about your situation:
Why am I going outside my marriage to meet my needs?
What are my values?
DOes my current husband share my same values?
If he doesn't, what do I plan to do about it? Am I staying in the marriage out of fear? Is love and friendship enough if 1, 2, 3 or more of my values are not being met?
If he does share my values then how can we can continue to remain together without him or me being hurt?
And so on….
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Post by BunnyEars on Nov 29, 2013 5:02:12 GMT -8
Thanks, LJ, I just read a couple of books on that which were pretty helpful, Too Good to Leave, Too Bad to Stay by Mira Kirshenbaum and Stay or Go by Liam Naden.
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Post by bittenkitten on Dec 28, 2013 20:17:39 GMT -8
Hi BunnyEars, my POA was a narcissist or sociopath...not sure which..but from what I am reading they trigger something very strong in us and makes it even harder. Part of it is we are not only giving them up but our dreams for our future up since the beginning of the relationship is pure fantasy. My POA lied like crazy. I was living a fairy tale that came to a screeching halt. Part of my obsession is I can't accept that the fairy tale was just that- a fairy tale. But it is more than that. Narcissist have a tendency to mirror us and create the perfect fantasy for us. So it is just like my little girl dreams...only to be taken from me.
I know with NC I will get better, and the more I work on myself I will get better...but I still want that quick fix of jumping into fantasy land and passion...you are not alone in how you feel that is for sure!
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Post by dhafirah on Dec 29, 2013 6:21:33 GMT -8
bittenkitten, that's me too. You would have thought my POA was in my head with the plans he made for our future. One thing that I should have paid attention to was whenever he said something that made me happy he would say something like "That made you happy, huh?" It was like he was satisfied that he scored points. It is hard to believe the fairy tale is not true. Why would someone make up something so major just to get a woman? He could have still had a woman without all the future plans (maybe not me, but somebody).
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Post by Loving My Life on Dec 29, 2013 8:44:46 GMT -8
But the point you are missing in all of this, is this: if your poa's had not make all of the promises to you, would you have even been interested in him? That is the question.
I know what I learned early on when I found this forum is this, I am a codependent love addict, and my poa is a sex addict narcissist, and these two combination are very toxic. The more my narcissist would pull away, the more I would run after him to prove my love, and to prove too him that he deserve love, and he fed off of this, and this a continuing unhealthy toxic relationship. I was his narcissistic supply, and he needed me to fed his sick ego, and this is very serious, this is not a joke.
I am not suggesting that your poa's are in this category but start reading all you can and see what you come up with. These men are not capable of loving anyone, they have no capacity for emotions, or feelings, and this is what I just could not understand, and I still don't, but some people are this way, and they will never change, so you just have to accept that it was all just a fantasy, and you have to heal your pain, and let this person go. They will find someone else to stroke their ego.
The longer you stay in this insanity, the more damage it will do to you and your self esteem, you will not be able to tell the truth from the false any longer, you then you are being led around like a puppy at this point, and this is not a good place to be, someone has total control over your thoughts and actions. This is where I was when I found this forum 3 years ago, and it took me all of this time to finally be rid of my poa. And I am just grateful that I never met these man in person, he would have really hurt me.
So in the process of trying to figure out the whys of your poa, please also keep the focus on yourself, and healing yourself, and working on your self esteem and self worth.
This is not about your poa's any longer, this is about you now, and saving your life, this is the reality.
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Post by LovelyJune on Dec 30, 2013 4:29:54 GMT -8
Loving My Life makes some great points, but I would like to add…
Unlike what most people will tell you, Narcissists DO have a capacity to love--but it's a very shallow, self-centered, fantasy-based love and very dangerous to someone who has zero identity (i.e. most codependents and love addicts). And just like a cancer that can only thrive in an unhealthy body, a narcissist thrives off people will very low self-esteem, and low sense of self, because while they do have a capacity to love, it is a love based on feeding their ego, getting not giving and making themselves feel good with their "possession." There is rarely any reciprocity coming from a narcissist because they are far too needy. And so, they are most attracted to givers. People who have no sense of self that will give to receive love in exchange. The point of me telling you this is not so that you learn more about narcissists, but that you learn more about YOU and why you "allow" these types of people into your life.
Build up your self-esteem, build up your values and your sense of self and these people will no longer appeal to you. You won't be able to handle their egocentricity and carelessness.
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Post by CodepNomore on Dec 30, 2013 10:44:12 GMT -8
1. I am terrified that at 41 years old, I will never again feel so much passion, but I also know that passion was manufactured by the fact that she never let me feel on solid footing. I'm worried that the only way to forget her is to obsess over someone else. 2. There are so many things I love about my life, but I ache for this THING I can't seem to hold onto. I've never had a woman love me the way I've wanted to be loved. I know bisexual relationships are inherently fraught with peril, so much potential for misaligned expectations, and I almost never behave this way with men--if anything, I play the love avoidant with men (I've done pretty well with making my husband feel loved enough to stay, but he's an exception) while with women I'm the love addict. Hi BunnyEars, I just came across this thread and read your first post only. Nevertheless I could hear you "loud and clear" because I have been there and done that. 1. Passion knows no age. I know many people who are still having passion in their 60’s. To forget a POA by obsessing over someone else was also my thought before. However, it only made things worse and multiplied my POAs and problems. 2. I know what you mean here and I have an idea why it is so. However, due to the sensitivity of this subject either I will PM you or I will get back to this thread later on. Remember you are not alone in this. There is hope for you. |
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Post by CodepNomore on Jan 1, 2014 7:19:44 GMT -8
1. I've never had a woman love me the way I've wanted to be loved. 2. I'm tired of being terrified to run into her. It's affecting my social life and my sense of well-being within the community. A lot of it has to do with how ashamed I fell for having fallen for her BS and made myself so lovesick over her. 3. I guess I'm looking for some deep healing/releasing techniques or some advice on how to really break an obsession which has lasted long after;withdrawal and NC. How do I get over my shame and;stand tall enough to face her when I run into her;on our small island? 1. That might be the root cause of your obsession towards her. 2. You are giving her so much power over you. Stop putting her up on a pedestal. Focus on your recovery goals instead of your fall. We cannot control what others (community) would like to think or say about us. 3. It takes time to heal and recover. What can make you stand tall enough to face her when the right time comes is your recovery. Your recovery will overcome those fears and shame you are battling right now. Therefore, work on your recovery daily.
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Post by torchbreaker on Apr 4, 2014 12:32:30 GMT -8
I am the same way - avoidant with men or at least more reasonable. A aching mess with women. Shame, embarrassment, confusion, 12 step meetings don't help because I have yet to hear anyone or meet anyone who can relate to this issue. I'm attracted to men as a whole, but have fallen for a few women in my life after being in friendships with them. |
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Post by sweetjasmine on Apr 14, 2015 19:29:03 GMT -8
hi bunnyEars!
I am not surely if i can give you the best advice. but for me obsessions in love is very difficult to relieve specially if he/she love each other right??but my advise for you is think and do the best for you so that you can feel better and you have a good life.
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