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Post by lostandconfused on Dec 15, 2010 23:18:32 GMT -8
Okay,
So on the advice of my therapist (who is now out of town for the holidays and can't contact for advice) I started dating... Short & sweet- I met him 10 years ago. We met again 2 years ago. I knew he was interested in me but I was too wrapped up in my 14 year obsession with my x and our relationship to ever give anyone else a chance. FYI: He is 8 years younger than me.
I finally decided to just give it a chance, after all I was attracted to him. Now we have been dating for the last two months. My problem is that I can't figure out now that I'm in a relationship with him-- if my being unhappy with our relationship is a red flag that he is emotionally unavailable or if my co-dependent issues are rearing their ugly head.
He only likes to see each other about once or twice a week. And I find myself getting really upset about it. As an example one night as a surprise I made him dinner from scratch - everything even the applesauce. And its been so long since I ever felt enough to put myself out there... it was a big step for me. Needless to say he didn't come over for dinner because we didn't have plans. I ended up crying for goodness sake! That made me even more upset. I was crying over a guy, what the heck? all i could think was...not again!!!
Of course he sent a text the next day saying how sorry he was to dissapoint me but was excited to see me that next night (when we did have plans). Me being hurt, canceled on him. (childish i know) i just felt so out of control having these feelings of being hurt again. so emotional - which is the cycle i felt like i had been in for longer than i should have with my x.
When I finally broke down to him and told him i was hurt and didn't like feeling so vulnerable - he of course was so d**n adult and said " we each have houses, jobs, and responsibilities, in addition, you have a child so I respect your time and only expect to see you when I have made plans with you in advance" then i felt naive, and childish, and like a teenager girl. (which i don't like)
that was a month ago. Now i find myself getting upset again because I can't see him unless we have plans in advance. And i don't feel like i should beg to see my boyfriend. in addition, he seems to really enjoy the 1 or 2 times a week thing. I am used to spending more time with someone I date.
So coming from a stuffpy relationship - from a sex addicted narcissist, and a screwed up family I can't decifer if he isn't really that into me or if I'm being retarded.
My mom always told me that men like to chase, that if a man likes/loves you, you will know it and you won't be confused. But I feel confused. Because, it seems like if a guy really likes you he would want to spend as much time with you as possible. (especially given my limited time with being a single mom who works full time)
The thing that complicates it for me is that when we are not together he is not out with friends. He is at home doing laundry, or writing songs for his band, or playing video games, alone.
He has told me that he likes alot of alone time and I am trying to respect that, but at the same time I don't feel like my needs are getting met.
Is that because my needs /desires for a relationship are out of wack because of my addiction issues or that I've been alone so long, or is that because he isn't emotionally available?
He did confess to me about a week ago that he struggles with his feelings because he was molested as a child. He actually said that he was emotionally dead, which I didn't know how to respond to..
Ugh. i'm just not in a good place! I don't know what to do. i don't want to ruin something because of my insecurities.. He is the first person I've met that I feel safe with, and that I want to give myself to completely. All his friends tell me how much he talks about me and likes me, although he doesn't say it to me...
should i end it? should i talk to him about it again? i don't want to nag him i know that's like the worst thing to do to a guy. and there is no way I want to be a nag.
i am so confused AGAIN!
sorry it wasn't that short & sweet... any advice would be appreciated!
lostandconfused still.
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Post by mgb on Dec 16, 2010 1:19:46 GMT -8
Lostandconfused,
I can see themes from my own story, echoed here and I know how you are feeling it can be overwhelming and you see like you are very sensitive. I too get confused about this issue, its like your scared you are sabotaging a potentially wonderful relationship because of you Love addiction, I can see what you are asking and I really don't know the answers either, because we want to connect and we want to love and be loved in return. The only things I can say to you is breath, try to relax , be true to yourself and take it really really slowly..... I hope this helps. keep us updated on your story. blessings. mgb.xo
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Post by lostandconfused on Dec 16, 2010 3:11:05 GMT -8
I am really begining to think that they should have relationship classes a prerequists for graduating high school. Not only do I think it would help the divorce statistics I think it would help everyone who is lost as I am.. Although therapists probably wouldn't make as much money..
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Post by mgb on Dec 16, 2010 3:19:34 GMT -8
Yeah, lol. I have long thought that too, the class should be called emotional integrity or something, and could encompass altruistic things , like kindness, compassion, understanding, truth, peaceful cooperation, love etc...... Maybe thats just my idealistic view, but this world needs a head check..... Love and peace. mgb.xo
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Post by LovelyJune on Dec 16, 2010 6:58:51 GMT -8
Lost--
I agree wholeheartedly with your mom: "My mom always told me that men like to chase, that if a man likes/loves you, you will know it and you won't be confused."
Love is not complicated. It's easy. When a guy likes you he calls you, he wants to be with you, he doesn't care if you have plans in advance. And unless you're expecting him to be with you 24/7 a man who is deeply interested in you would come over if you planned a special dinner as a surprise (unless of course, he had other plans).
A relationship (with ANYONE) is a dance of intimacy. You have preconceived ideas (values) as to how much time a couple should spend together, how you want to be treated, how you want to feel. Those feelings are neither right nor wrong. They are all yours and you need to respect them. The problem comes in when you meet someone who has OTHER preconceived notions of intimacy and how close a couple should be and what they should do etc. The trouble comes in when you meet someone who may like you but simply does not share your same values or notions of intimacy. You obviously want something a little more spontaneous and intimate. This man does not seem to want the same thing.
When a love addict is healing from bad relationships in the past, it's important to take dating slowly and not invest emotionally in anything too quickly. Chemistry is a great start, but...Get to know the other person's values first before having expectations of how they should behave.
I think your feelings of upset and frustration with this man are well founded and are, indeed, red flags. That's not to say he's a bad guy, and like Paisley said, he doesn't seem to have done anything rude or inappropriate. But don't sell yourself short. Don't minimize your feelings and consider them "childish." They are not. They are trying to tell you something and you need to listen. I think there is an incompatibility issue at play here and luckily, you are AWARE OF it. Part of the gift of recovery is to know and sense when things just aren't right. Trust your feelings. Respect your nature. So often we silence that voice!
It seems that this man may like you, but not in the way you NEED to be liked. As LAs newly in recovery we think we must stay away from the bad guys (which we must!) but that any nice guy that comes along is a good catch. Well, that's not true either. Two people need to be on the same page, share most of the same values or at least be willing to communicate about those values and make an investment in each other to the point of working on compatibility. Healthy recovery allows us to hear and see the signs, be aware of them, and take appropriate action, even if it means breaking up with someone.
Your confusion is well founded. And what's more, you have been hurt in the past and you are overly sensitive to neglect. Therefore, someone deeply interested in you would try to work with you on those issues. That doesn't seem to be happening here. Trust your instincts.
Lastly, I just want to add that while it's good practice to bend a little and be understanding, it's almost impossible to fit a square peg in a round hole. I'm not sure if you know what I mean, but basically, you can change little things about your nature, like behaviors. But you cannot change deep-rooted values within yourself. One of those values you typically cannot change is how you define intimacy. In my case, I was in love with a guy who needed a lot of alone time. I need alone time too, but I couldn't understand why he didn't want to spend a typical amount of time with me. While in the relationship, I ended up feeling lonely and isolated and questioning my own desire to spend time with someone. I kept telling myself I needed to change. I needed to learn how to accept this particular man's need for alone time. I told myself I was childish for needing so much time with someone. I soon found out that I was wrong for expecting myself to change. .When I met D we shared the same boundaries, and the same sense of closeness and intimacy and I NEVER question where he is or what he's up to or why he hasn't called. Love is a little chemistry and 90% friendship, compatibility and SHARED values. You may simply need to find someone who shares your idea of what it means to date and be intimate. This of course, is never easy to hear. We always hope it's in our power and under our control to "man up" and change who we are to fit into a relaitonship. But unfortunately we cannot do that to large extent. That is the love addiction side of us-- we fear losing the relationship no matter how much of a struggle it is because it's better than nothing. Recovery and health allow us to think logically, respect our nature and walk away if we need to.
Hope this helps!
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oldendances
Full Member
 
Newcomer Greeter
"Go Placidly amid the noise and haste and remember what peace there may be in silence"
Posts: 228
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Post by oldendances on Dec 16, 2010 12:57:28 GMT -8
I agree LostAnd,
Classes like that would be great. I would take it now if there was one available. It could cover what expectations people have, red flags, and setting boundaries. Bet you could open up a business doing this.
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Post by lostandconfused on Dec 16, 2010 13:08:35 GMT -8
WoW Telmita!
You always seem to know exactly what to say. Thank you so much for responding!!! And I think you are right on so many levels. I don't know why it is so hard for me just to accept myself and my needs instead of feeling like there is something wrong with me.
I do care about him immensly but now that I read what you wrote in black and white it really confirms what I am feeling. It's nice to have the words put out there. I seem to have a hard time validating my own feelings.
I think I will talk to him about how we have different needs and are most likely incompatible. Too bad really but its better to release the relationship now instead of making us both suffer needlessly.
thank you for taking the time and helping me!!!!!
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Post by LovelyJune on Dec 16, 2010 13:40:12 GMT -8
Lost-- You have trouble validating your own feelings because you've had no practice!  The more you do it and begin to TRUST yourself and your own judgment, you'll get good at it. And I too love the idea of a class! Let's start one 
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Post by person on Dec 16, 2010 19:22:11 GMT -8
My opinion is that this man is too young for you. Any man likes to have a woman younger than him. Anybody who tells you otherwise is just making stories. And he is not into you. If he really liked you, not talking about loved you, he would want to spend more time with you and not less.
I suggest you move on.
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Post by LovelyJune on Dec 17, 2010 4:55:31 GMT -8
Person, younger men/older women is a stereotype and it's a false one. And while I agree that it can be difficult to date someone MUCH older or younger, it's absolutely not true that men don't like older women. When you think in terms like that you falsely close yourself off to the possibility of getting to know people of any age. Not only that, but to BELIEVE that younger men are not capable of loving older women is to also believe that men are immature and can't think past the stereotypical "fantasy." Some can't, but many, healthy men CAN. Lastly, and most hurtful, it comes across as accusing a woman of being "too old." This can bring up issues of insecurity and loss of confidence, especially here. I'm sure you didn't mean to be hurtful. My current boyfriend, with whom I have been with for two years, loves me dearly and is 4 years younger than me. SOmetimes I too think I'm too old for him and then you know what? I slap that thought right out of my head and say, "I am a beautiful woman right down to the core, and am deeply loved." Period. For fun...here's a popular magazine article/blog about why younger men ADORE older women: www.more.com/2041/8159-why-younger-men-love-older And here's one by a men's magazine www.askmen.com/top_10/dating/top-10-things-we-love-about-older-women.html
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Post by lovely1 on Dec 17, 2010 18:22:33 GMT -8
Lostandconfused,
I feel you on this one. With the main POA I was involved with it was emails. I would send alot of emails and expect for him to return all of them. He refused saying he emailed me WAYYYY more than anyone else, but he was not going to match me email for email.
I knew what I wanted, but after a year or so of having many of my emails ignored, I began to doubt myself saying I was being ridiculous, putting too much stock into something silly like an email. Then I began to obsess. After that I started to negotiate with the POA like a politician. "well, how many can you return?" I'd ask, "three a day?" "One a day?" "three a week?" I turned myself inside out, upside down trying to get the number of emails just right so he would return them all.
Yet he never did, no matter the number. Some he'd return, but not others.
Years went by and I began to realize that while he was sporadic about returning my emails, I did have other friends/family who were more than happy to match me email for email and it wasn't a problem or a bother to them--in fact they were happy to hear from/correspond with me. Just not him.
In the end, after years and years of thinking I was being too needy by wanting him to return ALL of my emails, I went back to who I was before i got involved with him. And instead of living by email rules that make someone else happy, I live by my own rules. I don't spend time writing to people who make a habit of not writing me back. PERIOD.
I'm saying this to say, there are plenty of people (friends, family other dates etc) out there who would LOVE to have your homemade apple sauce five nights a week!!!! Why not spend the majority of your free time with them? If your current guy wants to take his time, keep his distance, co-operate with him and give him his alone time 7 days a week--if you know what I mean. Don't make any grand speeches or anything. Don't warn him. Don't sit him down for "a talk." Just do it. Stop calling/texing/emailing him compleltely. Let him call you--but make sure your dance card is full and only see him if YOU don't have any plans. Don't cancel plans because of him, make him wait if he wants to see you. Remember you're a valueable treasure, you're a precious gift and you don't have to convince anyone of this.
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Post by person on Dec 17, 2010 19:03:16 GMT -8
Telmita,
I specifically wrote in my post "in my opinion". Now, I am allowed to have opinions, am I not?
No, I did not mean to be hurtful, I just was expressing my opinion which I still maintain. Everybody is entitled to their opinions. So, this is my opinion. You are, of course, entitled to your opinions which differ from mine.
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Post by LovelyJune on Dec 18, 2010 3:41:26 GMT -8
Anybody who tells you otherwise is just making stories. Yes, Person. You're allowed to have an opinion. But the above is not an opinion. What's more, LAs sometimes have faulty thinking about things. I did too! For many years I believed in things that were not true at all. So, while you're absolutely allowed to have an opinion, I would hope that during recovery you'd be open to newer, healthier ways of thinking. 
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Post by person on Dec 18, 2010 13:12:23 GMT -8
Telmita,
A man 19 years younger than me contacted me today. If I become open to what you call "newer, healthier ways of thinking", I would have a relationship with him. It would be crazy.
I can adopt him as my son, but I would not have relationship with him. This is unethical. I hope that the recovery you are talking about does not include insanity of having a relationship with the man 19 years younger than me. If 19 is too big of a number, where does one stop, at what number?
I maintain my opinion. I believe that a man should be older than a woman at least 1 year. There is a phisiological reason for this. It is written about it. Boys develop slower than girls. So, they need more time. To balance this, a man needs to be not younger but older, at least a little bit.
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Post by LovelyJune on Dec 19, 2010 5:30:16 GMT -8
And while I agree that it can be difficult to date someone MUCH older or younger, it's absolutely not true that men don't like older women. 19 years is indeed a little unhealthy. I agree with you. But 3 to 5 years is not, unless the two people involved are unhealthy. Then, truthfully, any age will be a struggle. The bottom line is to date someone you feel comfortable with. But the reality is that NOT all men want younger women.
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Post by person on Dec 19, 2010 10:33:35 GMT -8
Telmita,
OK.
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